After the death of Saul, David became king of Judah in Hebron (2 Sam 2:11). The covenant was with the house of David. Samuel is getting old when he anoints Saul for kingship (1 Samuel 8:1-4). The damaged text: 1 Samuel 13:1 Psalm 119:63 I am a friend to all who fear You, to all who follow Your precepts.. Its not strictly necessary, but if youd like to give us additional information about this error, do so at our feedback site, https://hermeneutics.meta.stackexchange.com. [4]. The next time David was playing his harp before him he tried to kill him again. It involves love that flows from God to our hearts, a friendship love, and a physical love, that was designed by God. One day when the soldiers were returning home after David killed Goliath women had gathered in the streets singing and dancing. Then, taking Acts 13:21 into account, the NIV assumes that a number had dropped out of the second half of 1 Samuel 13:1, so that it should read, "and 42 years he reigned over Israel." The sages characterized the relationship between Jonathan and David in the following Mishnah: Whenever love depends on some selfish end, when the end passes away, the love passes away; but if it does not depend on some selfish end, it will never pass away. 3) David should've prioritized his marriage more than Jonathan. ." What makes a person a good friend? This is how the translators of the original and new King James versions interpreted the clause, for they rendered it: "Saul reigned one year." 1 Samuel 23:1418 David is strengthened by Jonathan while hiding from Saul. The NIV footnotes explains that the translators have assumed that Acts 13:21 is giving a round number when it says he only reigned for 40 years. These interpreters also argue that the description in 2 Samuel 1:26 of the love (Hebrew: ahava) between David and Jonathan that is greater than the love of women should be understood in light of the two earlier mentions of love (ahava) between David and Jonathan where it is described not as love for a romantic partner but love for self (he loved him as his own soul, 1 Sam 18:3; 20:17). Keil and Delitzsch; and is seen as referring to Merab and Michal: John Gill; T. Bab. Song of Solomon 4:16 (NASB), A more accurate translation would be Lover. He is a sexual lover involved in foreplay in verse 10 and sexual intercourse in verse 16. Make my garden breathe out fragrance, This attraction is given extravagant expression. They were not married (v. 21-22). He would also, of course, be substantially younger than Michal, Sauls younger daughter. It is the general Hebrew word for love. A friend loves at all times, Ish-bosheth was at most 20 when he became king over Israel. The biblical text does not explicitly depict the nature of the relationship between David and Jonathan. First, how could Saul become king when he was one year old, and especially since he obviously was much older? . Yes, we do look at every error. These verses reveal that David was no longer safe as Saul was planning to put him to death. 1992. vol. First & Second Samuel. It occurs 210 times in the Old Testament. WebSome claim that King David and Jonathan were gay. 1 Samuel 18:1-4 (NASB). These two men were becoming fast friends. . Jonathan would be about 35 when Mephibosheth was born. 2942 (Hypothetical) David driven away by Saul. On this Wikipedia the language links are at the top of the page across from the article title. Ish-bosheth is at most 30 when he takes Sauls place as king. Jonathan and David make a covenant of friendship. Saul had already been rejected for eight years. Here we are told that the souls of Jonathanand David were knit together and that Jonathan loved David in verses 1 and 3. Saul was XXX years old when he became king, and he reigned over Israel for XXX-two years. (Jesus). Presuming Samuel anoints David at around 20 years of age, he would have been at least 60 at this point of time, a realistic figure. Jonathan stripped himself of the robe that was on him and gave it to David, with his armor, including his sword and his bow and his belt. "King David." The covenant the two men had formed eventually led to David, after Jonathan's death, graciously seating Jonathan's son Mephibosheth at his own royal table instead of eradicating the former king Saul's line. Jonathan and David came up with a secret signal to let David know how Saul reacted. This is an important fact which reveals that knit is not the best translation. There is very little available data by which to answer this question. the description of David and Jonathan's first few meetings in 1 Sam 19:17. Saul is about 50 when he leads his troops to the defeat at Gilboa. Hold up the braided pieces. Your love to me was more wonderful than the love of women. Unlike Jonathan (he did not put on Davids shepherd clothes), Jesus put on our filthy rags (sin) when He was nailed on the cross. David and Jonathan Same sex relationship in the Bible? [39] (This event, however, is never described in the Bible, and this particular interpretation has been disputed by Diana V. Edelman, who remarked that, "Such a presumption would require David to have run off with the queen mother while Saul was still on the throne, which seems unlikely."[40]). Since his sons were old enough (though not moral enough) to be judges themselves at this time, they must be presumed to be around 30, and Samuel at least 50 years old. Since his sons were old enough (though not moral enough) to be judges themselves at this time, they must be presumed to be around 30, and Samuel at least 50 years old. Jonathan and David made a covenant, because Jonathan loved him as his very self. He [Kish] had a son named Saul, an impressive young man without equal among the Israelites the word bahur is used here, suggesting not youthfulness but vigour (the word often being used of warriors). These kind of friends dont think about what is best for ME, but what is best for each other, and how to glorify God. Jonathan and David became close friends: shake someone elses hand. (Ephesians 6:10-19), What did Jonathan give David when he made a covenant with him? Site design and hosting by . Now why did Jonathan do this? It was not sexual. That is why the NASB translates dod as Beloved., Awake, O north wind, Further, since the Bible overwhelmingly refers to homosexuality as a sin and wants us to not engage in this sin (Genesis 19:1-26; Leviticus 18:22; 20:13; Romans 1:22-28; 1 Corinthians 6:9; 1 Timothy 1:10), why would God select David to become the king of Israel? He went to the place that he and David agreed upon. 2 Samuel 2 Regnal details for David and Ish-bosheth Samuel "Has not Yahweh anointed you leader over his inheritance.. "As we have noticed, the attraction of Jonathan to David begins almost immediately as Saul is delighted in his new companion.We are told: "When David had finished speaking to Saul, the soul of Jonathan was bound to the soul of David" (1 Sam 18:1). Are 2 Samuel 24:13 (7 years of famine) and 1 Chronicles 21 (3 years of famine) a biblical contradiction? THE PROBLEM OF SAULS REIGN 1. [18], The story of David and Jonathan is introduced in Samuel 1 (18:1), where it says that "Jonathan became one in spirit with David, and he loved him as himself", something that modern scholars have described as philia or love at first sight. ." B&H Publishing. Do this a few times with the children. Ronald F. Youngblood. All who put their faith in Jesus as Savior take off their filthy rags and put on His robe of righteousness. Perhaps these homosocial relationships, based on love and equality, are more comparable with modern homosexual people's experience of themselves than those texts that explicitly speak of homosexual acts that are aggressive, violent expressions of domination and subjection. In other words, 1 Samuel 13:1 means that Saul has already reigned one year, and has only two more legitimate years to reign. [30], Other interpreters point out that neither the books of Samuel nor Jewish tradition documents sanctioned romantic or erotic physical intimacy between the two characters, which the Bible elsewhere makes evident when between heterosexuals, most supremely in the Song of Solomon. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. (Jesus gives believers His robe of righteousness), Why was Saul angry with David? As a starting-point, it will be supposed that the XXX-two value for Sauls reign length should be replaced with 2, 12, 22, 32, or 42 in other words just the tens figure has been lost and the units figure is correct. And when Saul had reigned two years. Saul took him that day and did not let him return to his fathers house. Why did he tempt Adam? This interpretation does full justice to the grammar of 1 Samuel 13:1a as well as to its context. Verse 16 refers to a covenantal relationship that Jonathan made with David. The important part of this passage is Davids statement Your love to me was more wonderful than the love of women. Homosexual advocates claim that love of women reveals that David and Jonathan were making love like men do with women. Kisses between men and between women were also common in ancient times (Genesis 45:14-15; Ruth 1:9; 1 Samuel 10:1; Acts 20:37). Then Jonathan and David made a covenant, because he loved him as his own soul. Every week, thousands of churches use our Bible lessons, craft ideas, printable resources, and coloring pages to teach kids the Christian faith. There are a number of possible resolutions to this. As we have seen, the death of the judge Abdon in the year 2909 provoked a national crisis. Acts 13:21, recording a speech by Paul This was first pioneered by Tom Horner,[17] then adopted by John Boswell. In this free Bible lesson, students will learn about Jonathan and Davids friendship. Another Old Testament expression for sexual intercourse is went in to her. It is descriptive and occurs eight times in the Old Testament (Genesis 29:23; 30:4; 38:2, 18; Judges 16:1; Ruth 4:13; 2 Samuel 12:24; Ezekiel 23:44). Yet, Some Logical Conclusions All the above is stated for the Jonathan around 45. Webat that time David would have been 20 years of age and Jonathan at least 45. Homosociality is not seen as being part of the sexual taboo in the biblical world. Abner brings David to Saul while David is still holding Goliath's severed head. Sanhedrin, fol. http://reformed-theology.org/ice/newslet/bc/bc.98.08.htm, Did Saul kill himself (1 Sam 31) or did the Amalekite soldier kill him? C4ktI)-O:26aW#(2v'>9jRvhMG(A#`P:wtt(HBV3~_3@zFZ[;$ ] ocyRAd2ssygO%p8 gQ{9k>eq. When 2 Samuel 1:25-27 says, Your love to me was more wonderful than the love of women, it is claimed that this proves Jonathan and David were gay. For his part, David is best known for his defeat of the giant Goliath. Your love to me was more wonderful Preceptaustin.org) Was King David gay? Both Daniel and Zechariah Ch 9-14 are the product of the Hellenistic era and have no messianic prophecies. Lets read verse 42. Jonathan is about 18 at the start of Sauls reign, and David is 30 at the end of it, so David is about 10 years older than Jonathan. The higher form of love in heaven will not include sex. Copyright Like The Master Ministries. [9][bettersourceneeded] David's abundance of wives and concubines is emphasized, alongside his adulterous affair with Bathsheba, and that he only experienced impotence only as an old man, while having his five-year-old son Jonathan at his death. 7. pp. Saul reigned 18 years while Samuel was alive and after his death 2 years. Whoever hurts a believer hurts Jesus. Jonathan is about 45 when his son Mephibosheth is born. The age difference between David and Jonathan could be lessened by supposing that Saul and Jonathan were both older than the values shown for example if Saul was about 10 years older and Jonathan in his late twenties at the time of his fathers accession. And they kissed each other and wept together, but David wept the more. 1 Chronicles 8:34 names him as Merib-Baal. Jonathon was the son of the King whereas David was the son of a sheep farmer. Scripture: 1 Samuel 18:1-16, 19:1-10,20 A quick glance at the Hebrew letters used for the numbers will show that some of them are rather similar in shape, making the likelihood of a copying error particularly great. (He was jealous of David because the Lord was with him), How did Jonathan protect David from being killed by his father? Hence other secondary clues must be used, and the results are not certain. The Hebrew word for knit is qasar, which refers to bind, knot, conspire, and league together. This word occurs 44 times in the Old Testament or Hebrew Scriptures and is usually translated as bind, conspirators, or conspired. Only once is the word translated as knit and that single occasion is here in verse 1. 1 Samuel 9:2 description of Saul The year 2910 was his first year of reign. J. Carl Laney. That is, Solomons wife is engaged in different activities that is commonly called foreplay today. Saul was probably about 40 when he began to reign, reigned 40 years, and died at about 80 years of age. Ish-bosheth could be nearly 40 when he took the throne (depending how long after Jonathan he was born), fitting with 2 Samuel 2. Saul; accession of Saul. Jonathan was better than a brother. In most cases, of course, such a procedure is proper, but in every case we have to read the information in context, comparing Scripture with Scripture, and make sure that our interpretation is sound before adding up the numbers. How long did Saul reign? 2993 Foundation of Temple laid, 480 years after Exodus. 199-200. Again, a higher figure is more probable. [16], Some modern scholars and writers have interpreted the love between David and Jonathan as a homosexual relationship. Bible Story:Davids Friend If Saul was eighteen at the birth of Jonathan then he would have been at least sixty at his death. 2. p. 706. 1 Samuel 13:1 literally says: "A son of one year was Saul when he became king, and two years he reigned over Israel." Shop our Sunday School Curriculum and Bible Lessons for Kids. David and Jonathan differ considerably in age, and Jonathan is unusually old for Mephibosheth to be his firstborn. Lets read 20:1-3. 1 Samuel 24:910, 1620 David spares Sauls life, and Saul recognizes Davids righteousness. Journal: Missionary Teaching Trip to Ghana, Liberia, Cote dIvoire and Senegal by Dr. John Oakes. Jonathan was about 18 at the start of Sauls reign he was entrusted with leading an attack on a Philistine outpost at this time (1 Samuel 13:2,3). (Angry, jealous) Jonathan was a prince and would be the next king after his father Saul. It means that a year after Sauls adoption by Samuel, or within that year, he became king "when he was one year old." Assumptions and inferences 14:9 Again, a higher figure is more probable. http://reformed-theology.org/ice/newslet/bc/bc.98.08.htm. In 1 Samuel 18:4, the NASB states that Jonathan stripped himself of his robe and gave it and his armor, sword, bow and belt to David. (When Jonathan gave David his military accoutrements, it symbolized that as his covenant partner, Jonathan was now obligated to protect and defend David no matter the cost. What happened during these two years? The purpose of this page is to consider the reign-length of Saul, as indicated by the various pieces of information in 1 and 2 Samuel. [28] The six sections she mentions are, Of these six examples, Ackerman identifies the most important example being the last one (the Song of the Bow) due to David's assertion that Jonathan's love to David "was more wonderful than the love of women".[28]. Answer: We know from 1 Samuel 18:1 that Jonathan loved David. Second Samuel 1:26 records Davids lament after Jonathans death, in which he said that his love for Jonathan was more wonderful than the love of a woman. Some use these two passages to suggest a homosexual relationship between David and Jonathan. For example, when I see the word worle I recognize that this is a spelling error and guess the actual word is world. Mephibosheth five years old when Saul and Conversely, the friend of one partner is also the friend of the other partner. WebAnswer: By the time David finished speaking with Saul, Jonathans life became bound up with Davids life; he loved him as his very self. The following diagrams show how the above pieces of information can be combined. (ESV) In our culture we might say that Jonathan and David had a kindred spirit. (Avot 5:16)"[8]. Consequently, the two men exchanged kisses of parting sorrow. Finally, it may well be that several diverse traditions concerning Saul were in existence, and that the forty year option was the one Paul had been taught. It is difficult to see how this could be realistically reduced to 30 years to fit the Septuagint reading of 1 Samuel 13:1, though a few years reduction could be made. Bring them out to us that we may have relations with them. Genesis 19:5 (NASB). 2 Samuel 1:25-27 is better understood as a very strong friendship commitment between two men. 1 Samuel 13:3, 4 Jonathan at Sauls accession Which is the true religion: Christianity, Islam or Zoroastrianism, and why? And eat its choice fruits! 1 Samuel 10:1 Saul anointed for rule. Thus, Jonathan was about 30 when David was born (a matter worth paying close attention to). J. Carl Laney summarizes the meaning of verse 3 with these words, The covenant of friendship referred to in verse 3 was a unilateral (binding on one party only) covenant in which Jonathan committed himself to David with complete disregard for self. Conclusion -- Jonathan was at least 58 years old when he died and David This was the love of Amnon and Tamar. "Ahinoam (Person)", The Anchor Yale Bible Dictionary. Every kids church ministry deserves the very best resources for teaching Gods Word, even when they dont have the financial resources. 9 (Edersheim). Jesus is the mighty friend of sinners. How did David do whatever Saul asked him to do? WebSo Ishbosheth was 10 years older than David, which means Jonathan was more than 10 years older than David. Additionally, David would be 28 when Saul took the throne, and it is not clear that the description of him as a youth would have been used. 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